tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21165575.post1863350653821484681..comments2024-03-10T20:46:19.274-04:00Comments on In the Middle: Gerald of Wales's Queer Ox-Man and Even More Queer Female Goat-FuckersCord J. Whitakerhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/06224143153295429986noreply@blogger.comBlogger5125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21165575.post-87834639309939013682011-02-15T09:28:47.246-05:002011-02-15T09:28:47.246-05:00You state in you article that Gerald demands that ...You state in you article that Gerald demands that the woman (who had sex with the goat/lion) AND her children should be killed as punishment. This is, in fact not at all the case. Gerald does not mention progeny at all, he asserts that both the woman AND the beast (ie the goat/lion) should be put to death (no mention of children whatsoever in the latin, nor in O'Meara's translation):<br /><br />'Pecus interfici jubetur non propter culpam, a qua bestialitas excusat; sed propter memoriae refricationem, quae ad mentem facinus revocare solet'<br /><br />As O'Meara puts it: 'The beast is ordered to be killed, not for the guilt, from which he is excused for being a beast, but to make the remembrance of the act a deterrent, calling to mind the terrible deed.'<br /><br />I don't think this quite negates your argument, however it is important to remember that Gerald does not hold the offspring to blame in the case of the ox-man, and offspring aren't particularly mentioned in the case of the women who had sex with animals. The women themselves are abhorred, and it is interesting that the parents of the ox-man are not mentioned.CNnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21165575.post-7364631638930731982007-03-26T02:55:00.000-04:002007-03-26T02:55:00.000-04:00Karl - many thanks for the reference. And no - my ...Karl - many thanks for the reference. And no - my reference was only to CdP herself - like you must dash now - maybe more later.<BR/>n50Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21165575.post-33475984097671849452007-03-25T17:42:00.000-04:002007-03-25T17:42:00.000-04:00More to say later, but I want to give everyone a l...More to say later, but I want to give everyone a link to <A HREF="http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article_id=444436&in_page_id=1770" REL="nofollow">this.</A><BR/><BR/>N50: yr Xine de Pizan reference, is it to Desmond and Sheingorn's piece on bestiality and women in the Epistre de Othea in Burger/Kruger's <I>Queering the MA</I>? Just reading that on the subway a moment ago...Karl Steelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03353370018006849747noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21165575.post-47710936078182065712007-03-25T10:13:00.000-04:002007-03-25T10:13:00.000-04:00There was a little girl,who had a little curl,righ...<I>There was a little girl,<BR/>who had a little curl,<BR/>right in the middle of her forehead.<BR/>And when she was good,<BR/>she was very, very good,<BR/>and when she was bad,<BR/>she was wicked.</I><BR/><BR/>I was going to add this to the Princess Buppy thread, but it will do as well here. This was my father's theme tune for me when I was little because of my curly hair, but of course it is the last lines that stuck in my head. The Mary/Eve - perfect/evil (perfectly evil?) dialectic constructed for little girls and women (and internalised by them) makes the queering of real women essential if they are to be allowed to be.<BR/><BR/>Married women - and the increasingly conflicted voices about married women in the high and later middle ages- carry a lot of this freight of queering - the WoB/Margery Kempe syndrome (and eg in Burger's <I>Chaucer's Queer Nation</I>). Is this part of Gerald's colonialist civilising agenda? More importantly are there other medieval writers (other than CdePizan) who directly address the queerness of women without pushing them into marriage? n50Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21165575.post-76236788032271801482007-03-25T07:55:00.000-04:002007-03-25T07:55:00.000-04:00speaking of "gemina natura"...i was reminded of th...speaking of "gemina natura"...<BR/>i was reminded of <A HREF="http://www.poetryfoundation.org/archive/poem.html?id=171427" REL="nofollow">this poem</A>joshhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03208813043756621394noreply@blogger.com