tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21165575.post8536755453635709864..comments2024-03-10T20:46:19.274-04:00Comments on In the Middle: The Werewolf's IndifferenceCord J. Whitakerhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/06224143153295429986noreply@blogger.comBlogger14125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21165575.post-38715021952616869852014-12-18T01:39:01.809-05:002014-12-18T01:39:01.809-05:00I'd say versipellis could support the reading ...I'd say versipellis could support the reading of hybrid, and it does not strike me as a rare word (and Karl: there's an argument that AngloNorman was exactly the place/time where Satyricon was better known, ca. 1100-1200, bc prosimetrum and Satyricon imitations sprout in these areas at exactly that time; and the baseline story is, Satyricon was known, just not the whole book but an abbreviated version and Poggio's was the extended version, so he cannot be credited for discovering but perhaps improving the canon of the Satyricon (although I don't know how relatively brief that brief version was, so. . .); to which I would add, if you read one hellenistic mediterranean novel, you've read them all, big difference, Satyricon or something else, it's all the same stories and they were just the most copied and popular thing around in the MA). In Poland, which still has an amazingly lively pagan folk culture continuing traditions that date back to times immemorial, so for instance, in the Highlands, in order to dress like an animal for the end-of-the-year trick-or-treating, you simply turn your ginormous long fur/sheep coat inside out. The inside part is looong fur, the outside, smooth when worn as a human: if you reverse them, you look like a yeti (or wolf or whatever). So, for me, versipellis is very clear and not at all a rare or odd word, it describes exactly the process I would imagine when turning into a wolf :o)Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05516783559603883158noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21165575.post-17640656655056172162014-12-17T21:16:23.101-05:002014-12-17T21:16:23.101-05:00I liked this essay JC. The Vulgate uses 'versi...I liked this essay JC. The Vulgate uses 'versipellis' -- Proverbs 14:25 'liberat animas testis fidelis et profert mendacia versipellis' and it is glossed in Old English glossaries, with 'praetig' (no less) and 'ficol' both of which of course mean 'deceitful, crafty.' It shows up in a small handful of interesting places in Old English texts but I don't have the other examples to hand.Eddie Christiehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17794240656809087999noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21165575.post-89040749004455593652014-12-17T18:20:07.079-05:002014-12-17T18:20:07.079-05:00The finished essay:
https://www.academia.edu/23582...The finished essay:<br />https://www.academia.edu/2358263/The_Werewolfs_IndifferenceJeffrey Cohenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17346504393740520542noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21165575.post-31857430602837556672011-11-05T14:22:44.799-04:002011-11-05T14:22:44.799-04:00I had managed never to meet this text until Richar...I had managed never to meet this text until <a href="http://unlocked-wordhoard.blogspot.com/2011/10/team-bisclavret.html" rel="nofollow">Richard Scott Nokes blogged about it the other day</a> (since I am catching up all asynchronous, that may itself have been because you'd written this...). Now I have interpretation (and I had thought the explanation of the wolf's 'shame' odd, also) too, thankyou!<br /><br />Minor copy-editor's point:<br /><br /><i>... “the animal part that within us all”... </i><br /><br />A word such as `lies' missing in either the source or the quotation, no?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21165575.post-3820220989953992722011-11-01T09:23:55.471-04:002011-11-01T09:23:55.471-04:00Reading the text in full he does seem a bit like t...Reading the text in full he does seem a bit like the Confeal. Legally justified in taking vengeance. This one turns up in much later oral narrative in the western Isles of Scotland that seem to maintain the correct legal definitions so has a life beyond the early med. period. <br /><br />I was struck by his capture, I have never seen the motif described in this way as being chained and beaten I thought was the standard form. But again it seems to highlight that his actions are reasonable. Absence of melancholia is also interesting particularly given the period it is written in.<br /><br />Makes me want to look at the Scottish variants of Lailoken/ Myrddin that focus strongly on adultery. <br /><br />Interesting text.Jebnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21165575.post-75433708533431287862011-10-30T12:33:03.472-04:002011-10-30T12:33:03.472-04:00I enjoyed this. Not looked at this subject for yea...I enjoyed this. Not looked at this subject for years.<br /><br />One early Irish legal code I particularly like in relation to this that no one seems to look at. <br /><br />Irish law of blood letting, it sets out the compensation payments paid for medical treatment to those injured in battle and other acts of violence where the opposing party is considered legally responsible for dispute. <br /><br />Three female figures are found who are entitled to half normal compensation. <br /><br />They are described as the conrechta (the wolf/ dog who speaks with a human voice), Confael (the howling one) and the good wife saved from the fairies, a person traditionally considered to be mute. <br /><br />Fael to howl most often turns up in compounds which are euphemisms for wolf. Faelad 'to become a wolf' literally means to go a howling. <br /><br />When the wolf speaks with a human voice it is the most terrifying creature in the whole of Ireland.<br /><br />Certainly powerful, the conrechta is described as a female satirist who turns back the streams of war with her tongue. Confeal is a vengeance taker but morally entitled to engage in violence and entitled to compensation for any injury sustained in such action. <br /><br />This is early 7th century but I think already the themes that play out in a range of later texts concerning language and reason are in place and under discussion at this time.Jebhttp://simianaturae.wordpress.com/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21165575.post-62450292923538447902011-10-28T06:31:46.932-04:002011-10-28T06:31:46.932-04:00Thanks for all the comments, everyone. I was runni...Thanks for all the comments, everyone. I was running a panel yesterday so I am late getting back to this, but I want to say that I used the phrase "Latin possesses no *common* noun for werewolf" because I am not such a good Latinist that I can clear with confidence NO word for werewolf existed, just that no word of wide currency was out there. I know that lack of a word does not equate to lack of a concept, of course, but here I do think it is revealing: the vernacular sources and terms convey a two-in-oneness that the Latin writers cite in order to convey a compoundedness that their humans-to-wolves don't possess.Jeffrey Cohenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17346504393740520542noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21165575.post-74124153877115688442011-10-28T05:01:57.849-04:002011-10-28T05:01:57.849-04:00Nice post - and nice coincidence: tomorrow I will ...Nice post - and nice coincidence: tomorrow I will give a lecture about hunting the bear in the Middle Ages very focusing on the matter of "cross contamination" (Karl knows ...) between human and, in my view, super human bear's body. Another argument is that the possibility of transformation supports the idea that, at least until XII century, european experience (if not theological and philosophical thought) of animals (and, to me, landscape) still faced a natural world full of animal somehow interpreted as problematic subjects and not just objects of dominance practices.<br />PaoloPaolo Gallonihttp://www.paologalloni.itnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21165575.post-36773298587789238122011-10-27T11:12:06.231-04:002011-10-27T11:12:06.231-04:00Today is just not my day for coherence. I think it...Today is just not my day for coherence. I think it's because I should be grading papers.<br /><br />Here's a short, coherent summary:<br /><br />Latin does have a word for werewolf, "versipellis." However, a preliminary search suggests that medieval Latin used the word only to mean "deceiver" or "hypocrite" or "traitor." And while Petronius and, more relevantly for medieval textuality, Pliny use "versipellis," the word still suggests a person changing from one thing into another temporarily, rather than melding wolf and human into a hybrid self. In short, Latin has vocabulary for humans who turn into wolves, but <i>not</i> the vocabulary for people who are <i>also</i> wolves.Karl Steelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03353370018006849747noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21165575.post-85474100315118996082011-10-27T11:05:52.955-04:002011-10-27T11:05:52.955-04:00I'd also say that the Pliny supports Jeffrey&#...I'd also say that the Pliny supports Jeffrey's reading: the Latin has people CHANGING their skin, not inhabiting two skins at the same time, as it were. Basically, Pliny describes a werewolf in the same way that Gerald of Wales does, or, for that matter, CW Bynum. <br /><br />Only the vernacular allows for this possibility, not Latin.Karl Steelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03353370018006849747noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21165575.post-64660948869841414232011-10-27T11:02:59.874-04:002011-10-27T11:02:59.874-04:00This is far outside my expertise, but so far as I ...This is far outside my expertise, but so far as I know Petronius was not read, or barely read, in the Middle Ages. Poggio Bracciolini pretty much rediscovered what we have. So Satyricon is going to be irrelevant for the Middle Ages. Of course I could be totally wrong here.<br /><br />More relevant, however, is Pliny's <a href="http://monumenta.ch/latein/text.php?tabelle=Plinius&rumpfid=Plinius,%20Naturalis%20Historia,%2008&id=Plinius,%20Naturalis%20Historia,%2008,%20%2080&level=99&level9798=&satz=80&string=versipelles&binary=&domain=&lang=0&von=advkonkordanz&hide_apparatus=1&inframe=1&jumpto=80#80" rel="nofollow">Natural History</a>:<br /><br />Sed in Italia quoque creditur luporum visus esse noxius vocemque homini, quem priores contemplentur, adimere ad praesens. inertes hos parvosque Africa et Aegyptus gignunt, asperos trucesque frigidior plaga. homines in lupos verti rursusque restitui sibi falsum esse confidenter existimare debemus aut credere omnia quae fabulosa tot saeculis conperimus. unde tamen ista vulgo infixa sit fama in tantum, ut in maledictis versipelles habeat, indicabitur.<br />81 <br />Euanthes, inter auctores Graeciae non spretus, scribit Arcadas tradere ex gente Anthi cuiusdam sorte familiae lectum ad stagnum quoddam regionis eius duci vestituque in quercu suspenso tranare atque abire in deserta transfigurarique in lupum et cum ceteris eiusdem generis congregari per annos VIIII. quo in tempore si homine se abstinuerit, reverti ad idem stagnum et, cum tranaverit, effigiem recipere, ad pristinum habitum addito novem annorum senio. id quoque adicit, eandem recipere vestem. mirum est quo procedat Graeca credulitas! nullum tam inpudens mendacium est, ut teste careat. <br /><br /><a href="http://www.masseiana.org/pliny.htm#BOOK%20VIII" rel="nofollow">translation</a><br />But in Italy also it is believed that the sight of wolves is harmful, and that if they look at a man before he sees them, it temporarily deprives him of utterance. The wolves produced in Africa and Egypt are feeble and small, but those of colder regions are cruel and fierce. We are bound to pronounce with confidence that the story of men being turned into wolves and restored to themselves again is false—or else we must believe all the tales that the experience of so many centuries has taught us to be fabulous; nevertheless we will indicate the origin of the popular belief, which is so firmly rooted that it classes werewolves among persons under a curse. Evanthes, who holds no contemptible position among the authors of Greece, writes that the Arcadians have a tradition that someone chosen out of the clan of a certain Anthus by casting lots among the family is taken to a certain marsh in that region, and hanging his clothes on an oak-tree swims across the water and goes away into a desolate place and is transformed into a wolf and herds with the others of the same kind for nine years; and that if in that period he has refrained from touching a human being, he returns to the same marsh, swims across it and recovers his shape, with nine years' age added to his former appearance; Evanthes also adds the more fabulous detail that he gets back the same clothes. It is astounding to what lengths Greek credulity will go; there is no lie so shameless as to lack a supporter.<br /><br />If it's used in Pliny, then of course the word's known to the Middle Ages, yeah? But if it's NOT USED (perhaps because it's too recherché), and if LUPUS is used in preference, and also English and French and Breton words, well, that's interesting.Karl Steelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03353370018006849747noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21165575.post-68308330934610480212011-10-27T10:16:44.909-04:002011-10-27T10:16:44.909-04:00Apologies for the double-comment then (I really ne...Apologies for the double-comment then (I really need to get on Google+, apparently...)<br /><br />Here is the quote from Petronius: "[LXII] Forte dominus Capuae exierat ad scruta scita expedienda. Nactus ego occasionem persuadeo hospitem nostrum, ut mecum ad quintum miliarium veniat. Erat autem miles, fortis tanquam Orcus. Apoculamus nos circa gallicinia; luna lucebat tanquam meridie. Venimus inter monimenta: homo meus coepit ad stelas facere; sedeo ego cantabundus et stelas numero. Deinde ut respexi ad comitem, ille exuit se et omnia vestimenta secundum viam posuit. Mihi anima in naso esse; stabam tanquam mortuus. At ille circumminxit vestimenta sua, et subito lupus factus est. Nolite me iocari putare; ut mentiar, nullius patrimonium tanti facio. Sed, quod coeperam dicere, postquam lupus factus est, ululare coepit et in silvas fugit. Ego primitus nesciebam ubi essem; deinde accessi, ut vestimenta eius tollerem: illa autem lapidea facta sunt. Qui mori timore nisi ego? Gladium tamen strinxi et umbras cecidi, donec ad villam amicae meae pervenirem. In larvam intravi, paene animam ebullivi, sudor mihi per bifurcum volabat, oculi mortui; vix unquam refectus sum. Melissa mea mirari coepit, quod tam sero ambularem, et: 'Si ante, inquit, venisses, saltem nobis adiutasses; lupus enim villam intravit et omnia pecora tanquam lanius sanguinem illis misit. Nec tamen derisit, etiamsi fugit; senius enim noster lancea collum eius traiecit'. Haec ut audivi, operire oculos amplius non potui, sed luce clara Gai nostri domum fugi tanquam copo compilatus; et postquam veni in illum locum, in quo lapidea vestimenta erant facta, nihil inveni nisi sanguinem. Vt vero domum veni, iacebat miles meus in lecto tanquam bovis, et collum illius medicus curabat. Intellexi illum versipellem esse, nec postea cum illo panem gustare potui, non si me occidisses. Viderint quid de hoc alii exopinissent; ego si mentior, genios vestros iratos habeam."<br /><br />Again, it's a word that etymologically suggests "skin-shifter," but in this context it clearly designates a werewolf. Haven't encountered the term in medieval Latin.ProMedievalistnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21165575.post-53563875951431923832011-10-27T09:45:57.096-04:002011-10-27T09:45:57.096-04:00Hi ProMedievalist:
On G+, Derrick Pitard made a s...Hi ProMedievalist: <br />On G+, Derrick Pitard made a similar observation, and I did a quick check via the <a href="http://bsbdmgh.bsb.lrz-muenchen.de/de/fs1/search/query.html?fulltext=versipellis&text=true&subSeriesTitle_str=&sort=score&order=desc&hl=false&action=Finden%21" rel="nofollow">MGH</a> and <a href="http://monumenta.ch/latein/advkonkordanz.php?suchbegriff2=versipellis&binary=&modif=&domain=&lang=0&tabelle=Latein&id=&kkwlaus=kk_alle&von=advsuchen&suchbegriff=versipellis" rel="nofollow">this collection.</a><br /><br />Short explanation: so far as I can determine, none of these writers use versipellis as werewolf. They use it for "deceiver," "hypocrite," "traitor," etc. If you can find a werewolf in these or elsewhere in the medieval Latin corpus, let me know! My curiosity is up, but unfortunately I don't have access to the Acta Sanctorum, PL, or the CCSM, and I don't think there's an online version of the Sources Chretiennes...Karl Steelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03353370018006849747noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21165575.post-90774015224798259722011-10-27T09:36:14.836-04:002011-10-27T09:36:14.836-04:001) Very much enjoyed this. Was not the Latin word...1) Very much enjoyed this. Was not the Latin word versipellis used for werewolf, though? (I believe I first encountered it in Petronius' Satyricon.) Its etymological meaning ("turn-pelt") has nothing to do with wolves, of course, so perhaps your point stands. But I thought that the word was used to designate lycanthropes specifically.<br />2) Excellent Bear Grylls reference.ProMedievalistnoreply@blogger.com